Episode 219 | She’s the Bridge (Part 1) with Vivian Mabuni

She’s the Bridge (Part 1) with Vivian Mabuni

“As women of color, we can’t walk away from the conversation because it is our lived experience day in and day out” –Vivian Mabuni

“When leaders don’t use proper terminology, like COVID, and instead use a term like ‘Chinese virus’ or ‘Kung Flu,’ that hurts my community.” –Vivian Mabuni

“I am so grateful for the leadership of the black community in civil rights that have made way for injustices to be exposed, that Asian Americans can have a different life because we stand on the shoulders of the leadership of the black community.” –Vivian Mabuni

About Vivian Mabuni

Vivian Mabuni is a national speaker and author, bible teacher, and podcast host. Her writing has appeared in Christianity Today, SheReadsTruth, Our Daily Bread, and Propel Sophia. She has been a keynote speaker at conferences, universities, and churches across the country, including IF: Gathering, QCommons, and Biola University. With 32 years serving on staff with Cru, Viv loves teaching about the Bible and practical application to ministry and life and serves on the Board of Trustees at Denver Seminary. Author of “Warrior In Pink” and “Open Hands, Willing Heart,” and host of the podcast for AAPI (Asian American Pacific Islanders) leaders “Someday Is Here,” Viv loves drinking coffee with her husband of 29 years, Darrin, and marveling at their three young adult kids.

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The full episode transcript is below.

Narrator  0:01  

You are listening to the Be The Bridge podcast with Latasha Morrison.  Each week, the Be The Bridge podcast tackles subjects related to race and culture with the goal of bringing understanding, 

Latasha Morrison  0:16  

…but I’m gonna do it in the spirit of love.

Narrator  0:19  

We believe understanding can move us toward racial healing, racial equity, and racial unity. Latasha Morrison is the founder of Be The Bridge, which is an organization responding to racial brokenness and systemic injustice in our world. This podcast is an extension of our vision to make sure people are no longer conditioned by a racialized society, but grounded in truth. If you have not hit the subscribe button, please do so now. Without further ado, let’s begin today’s podcast. Oh, and stick around for some important information at the end.

Madison Potts  0:54  

Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Be The Bridge podcast. If you’re a regular listener, then I know you don’t recognize my voice. Well, I’m Madison Potts. I’m a political science major at Kennesaw State University here in Georgia. And I’ve been blessed with the opportunity to work as an intern for the Be The Bridge organization in my senior year. And, the cherry on top? Today I’ve been honored with the opportunity to be a guest podcast host. Be The Bridge founder and regular podcast host Latasha Morrison will be back soon. I know she misses connecting with you as much as you miss hearing her wisdom, insights and thoughtful questions each episode. But again, she’s doing well and will be back soon. We’re starting a new series that Be The Bridge will be dipping into periodically throughout this season. This new series is entitled She’s The Bridge. Don’t you love that? I know. Me too. In the quest for racial reconciliation, often the focus is on male thought leaders and organizers. This series highlights not just female voices, but diverse female voices with hearts for God and a deep desire for bridge-building. Well, I’m excited about one of those thought leaders, Vivian Mabuni. Vivian is a dynamic author and speaker. But what really speaks to me is that she’s passionate about seeing God raise up a generation of leaders who have a cultural and spiritual impact on campuses, families, churches, and communities around the world. This should help you understand why God knit Vivian and Latasha’s hearts together. Not wanting you to miss out on such a substantive dialogue, Latasha had Be The Bridge director of programs and innovation, Faitth Brooks take on this conversation. Often conversations as it relates to race are framed around black and white dynamics. Vivian happens to be a Chinese American. As a side note, you’re going to hear the acronym AAPI periodically throughout today’s discourse it simply stands for Asian American Pacific Islanders. With that in mind, I love where Faith starts this conversation. So let’s jump right in. 

Faitth Brooks  3:06  

Yeah, and you know, I think one thing that some people might not pay attention to or notice, especially when conversations about race can be caught in just a black white binary, is that there are other people who are a part of different ethnic groups and communities that are non white, that oftentimes find themselves the only or only one within a room or one of the few. And I have just seen you over the years, cultivate community for Asian American women who were one of the only or one of a few in rooms and bring people together I think of you as a deep connector of people, which I absolutely love. So what inspired you to do that and start the Someday Is Hear podcast and also the community?

Vivian Mabuni 4:03  

Well, it again, kind of goes back to and I think this is true, what you’re talking about that often in our conversations, the binary black and white does not include Asian American Pacific Islanders, native, Latin-x, Latino, Latina voices, Hispanic, whichever the choice of use, and I’m even mindful of my middle eastern brothers and sisters of you know, Middle Eastern descent. And so, and even within the AAPI community, there are often more voices in the majority of Chinese, Japanese and Korean. And we miss the South Asian, the Southeast Asian voices and the Pacific Islander voices. And so I feel like that’s all part of my own growth and learning is to begin to be increasingly mindful of what voices aren’t being heard. Heard. So in the work that I do, I’ve been on staff with crew with for 32 years. So I’ve been in vocational Christian ministry for the whole time. And I have sought to speak into the lack of diversity on a leadership level in the ways that we evaluate leadership. And as I have grown in influence with speaking in white spaces, in particular, very mindful of how often what voices are missing. And so in my own journey, I remember, you know, I mean, obviously, I think for any person of color, when we get, you know, the lineup for any kind of event we’re scanning, we’re looking for anyone who looks like us, and, and I think women are looking for women. But then in, in addition to that, we’re looking for women of color, we’re looking for anyone who looks like me, and it’s 2021 Faitth, and I still to this day, have Asian American women, and even just women of color come up to me after I speak and say, You are the first person I’ve ever heard, who looks like me, you know, speak on a mainstage. And there is something that shifts when that takes place. Because you can’t be what you can’t see. And so that really is what fuels so much of what I’m doing now. So Someday Is Here, you know, it started off, back back when I first met Tasha at the first If gathering and I scribbled on the back of the domino, help to help raise up the next generation of Asian American Christian women leaders. And I left that Domino on my, on my dresser for years. And a number of events took place, such that I thought, you know, we’ve got to do something. And that is really what was born out of it. And obviously, naturally, since everybody does podcast that was, that became a space that was carved out. But I really loved the model that truths table has, where it’s, for black women, by black women, and me as a non-black woman can sit in and listen to a very authentic conversation. And even just through the the types of topics that are talked about, I’m learning about black culture. So in the same way, with some days here, it’s not a Christian podcast, though, most of my guests have been Christian, but I’ve selected women leaders who represent all different communities in the AAPI world. And so it’s been important the transracial adoptees story is different than the first generation immigrant story is different than the sixth generation Chinese American story or an on and on. So I’ve found a place to validate to explore how our Eastern and Western cultures fuse to, to make us who we are. So as a Chinese American, you know, I don’t feel like I fit in often in the US, because people other me all the time, like, Where are you really from, even though I don’t speak with an accent. And you know, I was born in Wisconsin. But if you drop me in the middle of the streets of Shanghai, I may blend in externally, but I think and dream and have values that are not the same as Chinese from China. So I really feel like Asian American is a fusing of two worlds, drawing traits from both. And so to be able to talk about that and to explore and to be on that journey has been just incredibly life-giving. Just keeps me up at night excited.

Faitth Brooks  8:48  

I love that. And then was it 2019 forgive my timings, because I really don’t know. I mean, last year was a blur. So now I don’t know what what happened when. But you held your first in person event, what year was that?

Vivian Mabuni 9:04  

It was 2020. Faith, okay, right before the whole world shut down. And it was, yes, it was our first in-person event. And it was incredible, because all of the presenters, literally we had no, no central funds to to do anything. And so it was just a love fest because all of the presenters came on their own dime. They came because they recognize the importance of representation matters, that they longed for a space that to be where every story was intuitively understood. And so it was a game-changer for so many of us. I think many of the attendees as well, as the presenters commented that that was the first time they had ever seen the entire program from beginning to end, honor, celebrate, and explain and explore and it was just so beautiful and you were such a champion of that you and Tasha and Be The Bridge, I just am so grateful because it really was it was a bringing together of so many external pieces to help make something like this happen.

Donald Trump  10:19  

China as opposed to the Chinese virus, 

Random Person  10:23  

I hate Asians (Beep)

News Person  10:24  

A woman who’s Asians,   say she was punched by another woman in midtown Manhattan,

Random Student  10:29  

one of the girls said, all Chinese people were disgusting.

Donald Trump  10:33  

I can name Kung Flu,

Madison Potts  10:37  

Disgusting, appalling. Forget micro, has anyone coined the phrase macro-aggression? Sadly, for some, all of that sounded fair and thoughtfully reasonable. I’m sure the sentiment behind the clips you just heard pushed Faitth in this direction. Listen.

Faitth Brooks  10:54  

I have a question for you. I wasn’t planning on asking you this. So. But it just came to mind. You know, in society, oftentimes now, people make comments and statements, and will say negative things about China and Chinese people. And especially when the comments are directed towards, you know, China and China’s a country and all the negativity, how does that make you feel as a Chinese American, especially with the rise of the, you know, Anti-Asian, you know, rhetoric and hate crimes and things like that.

Vivian Mabuni 11:37  

It has been incredibly painful. I think there’s, I’m a cancer survivor, too. So there was a time when I was bald and didn’t have any hair because of chemo and recognize that my disease entered the room, even before I did, like people would just determine things about me without ever having heard my story. And in the same way, you and I, as women of color, we can’t walk away from the conversation, because it is our lived experience day in and day out. But there’s often not any context. So before even having a conversation, there’s judgment passed. I have friends who are fifth generation Chinese, like their great great, great grandparents built the railroad in the 1800s in the United States of America. And yet the Chinese Exclusion Act in 1882, banned my entire people group. And my parents came to the United States in 1965, via the education route, when things were finally opened up beyond the 105, I believe that could come in in 1943, when was finally overturned. So there’s just the whole history of the sentiment of Americans against Chinese. And I think as an Asian American, because there’s so few of us, we just we need to link arms. But I remember learning in history class in high school about the bombing of Pearl Harbor, and wanting my friends to know I’m not Japanese, I’m not Japanese. And that same feeling that the Chinese felt when the Japanese internment, you know, all happened. There’s this fear of being lumped in like Don’t, don’t decide who I am, right. And so now with the hate crimes, it’s not just directed toward Chinese that some of the victims have been Thai and South Asian. I mean, there’s just it’s not a Chinese thing. But it’s anyone who looks remotely Asian, all of a sudden becomes the enemy. So words matter. And leadership matters. And when leaders don’t use proper terminology, like COVID, and instead use a term like Chinese virus or Kung Flu, that hurts my community. It causes the fear to be directed towards people who have no no relation whatsoever who have never stepped foot into the country of China even to be targeted. And in my community, and with my culture, we have such a high honoring of our elderly, that’s infused into our DNA, and to feel so helpless to worry from my own parents is it’s a real deeply felt fear. And I felt it myself, even when, you know, lockdown took place and there was an immediate uptick of Anti-Asian hate crimes. I began to feel fearful of going out into the public into the grocery stores, and I remember even before COVID I remember being with My Someday Is Here team, and we were out to dinner celebrating the launching of the podcast. And we’re all people of color except for one, you know, and we were sitting outside and all sudden, this man started screaming in the parking lot yelling things. And he was clearly mentally unstable. But at the time, I wasn’t sure what was going on. But for the first time, Faitth, I literally looked around and thought do we get under the table? Like, the fear of the safety, you know, there’s just, it’s just changed, the whole atmosphere has changed. And it’s, it’s a very real, real lived experience right now.

Madison Potts  15:42  

Malcolm X said, You can’t separate peace from freedom, because no one can be at peace unless he has his freedom. I think most of us can agree that the opposite of peace is fear. So in essence, replacing peace with fear is replacing freedom with a form of bondage. Second, Timothy 2:17, lets us know that this type of bondage does not come from God. Let’s listen as this concept is unpacked.

Faitth Brooks  16:08  

People, the one thing that’s hard sometimes for people to understand, is the fear that so many people of color, feel and experience in. It’s like, how can I explain this fear, it’s like, you can’t, you can’t explain it away. You can’t give a you know, I can’t give a dissertation to you on the fear that you feel. Whenever you’re dealing with somebody who is really being hateful towards you. It is just there. And you are aware that, like you said, your existence speaks for itself when you walk into a room, there’s no, you don’t get to convince somebody you don’t get to explain away yourself to somebody, you don’t get to let them get to know you, just the outside of you alone, is telling a story. And we all have unconscious biases. And those unconscious biases go off in people’s minds. And all of a sudden, there’s a story about you, and who you are before you even have room to speak in for people to get to know you. And so I want to know from you, have you ever felt silenced? And if you have, especially as you talk about your Someday Is Here community, how did you decide to reclaim your voice?

Vivian Mabuni 17:33  

Hmm, it’s a great question. I, of course, have felt silenced, you know, all along. And what’s interesting is my culture, the foundation of a lot of Asian culture is based in Confucian teaching. And Confucian teaching teaches that for a woman, when a daughter, you obey your father, when a wife, you obey your husband, when a widow, you obey your son. And so there’s this immediate like one down as a woman. And then on top of that, culturally, there’s a hierarchy that we value. So if you are older, more seasoned, experienced, have a higher rank of leadership, there’s a deferring to that all the time. So again, you don’t rock and we don’t rock the boat. That’s another cultural way of honoring, it’s truly it’s based out of valuing others. It’s a collective culture that I’m so proud of. And I think for a long time, I wanted to push that part of me down, and kind of lean more into, I’m an American, and I have a blue passport. And I have my rights. And, you know, and I can, I’m proud to be an American, I can see that singing that song. And to me, reclaiming this part of my story and who I am. And the pride that I feel for being of Chinese descent is been something, it’s an area that I’m continuing to grow in. So as it comes to reclaiming my voice, I think that that all of us in our ethnic journeys, we are all on a journey. And so some of it’s the first step is the awareness piece. And as I’ve done ministry with a number of people over time, there’s really, sometimes a hatred of that part. And then there’s the the acceptance, the awareness, and then the celebration and then the contribution. So where where I’ve come to now is learning to show up in spaces and understand that the way that I navigate is not going to be necessarily individualistic with a quarterback mindset. Where it’s like it’s all about the leader. I am thrilled that what we’re doing with Someday Is Here is it’s a collective community and we are gonna cheer each other on and there’s an abundance mentality rather than scarcity. I want to believe that in the future, it’s not just that a conference stage is limited to the one Asian and the one South Asian, and that you know, that the it just can look so much better and tastes so much better. And they’re just the offering can be so much richer as we bring all of who we are.

Faitth Brooks  20:37  

I love that so much. Because I think oftentimes people, you know, there can be this scarcity mentality amongst people of color, sometimes when it feels like, “Oh, well, there can only be one of us here, right?” And the truth is, there’s room for all of us. And it doesn’t have to just be Oh, there’s only one. And I think that sometimes in communities, whenever you are one of a few, it can feel like people are checking off a box, like, “Okay, see, got one, we got one from each community, that’s great.” But it also sends a message, you know, to us as people of color that there’s only room for one of you. And if we have one of you, that’s enough, right? And so I think that we have to move into having a broader conversation of why it is so beautiful, to have a variety of different voices at the table. Tasha always talks about how we are not a monolith, right. And so we all have different thoughts, behaviors, views, ways of approaching things, we are not all alike. And we have different interests, you know, and I think that’s really important to highlight and to recognize that when you invite different people to the table, even if they are from the same, you know, ethnic background, they’re still going to bring something different, each person is very different. And so I think it’s important to highlight that, and I love that you said that, because it’s something that we can easily overlook. And think that oh, yeah, okay, great. We’ve arrived, because we’ve done this right. And so I know even the conversations that we’re having right now, as we address the anti-Asian hate crimes and racism, there’s been a conversation going on between the black community in the AAPI community. And for those of you who don’t know, last year be the bridge partnered with the Asian American Christian collaborative. Tasha did some great instructional videos. And they really were talking about how do we address the divide between the Asian community and the black community. And there’s a guide that’s created for you to walk through his videos, go check it out with the Asian American Christian collaborative. But I wanted to talk a little bit more about that with you, Vivian, we know that there has been a divide amongst the black community in the AAPI community. And a lot of what has caused a divide is truly white supremacy. And it is this you know, pitting against of communities, and also the creation of the model minority myth, right, which is then put forth to other communities of color or, or to black people. And it’s kind of like, see, you need to be like them, right, or you don’t get this because you’re not them. They’re the good, the good ones you aren’t. And so it creates this pitting against of our communities and also distrust right in there. You know, we can circle back historically, and look at things that have happened during the Rodney King riots, and everything there that is created even further distrust between our communities. And so there’s a lot of healing that has to happen. And there’s a lot of healing that needs to take place. And so, you know, when we think about taking this journey towards healing, what are you doing in your personal life? What does that look like? How do we move forward and try to find healing amongst you know, each other. But then I’ve also seen some my friends in the AAPI community saying, we also have to address the anti-blackness in our community, and we have to heal the divides. And so it just feels feels like cumbersome, heavy lifting we have to do but how are you navigating that and your personal life? 

Vivian Mabuni 24:26  

Wow, that’s a big question. And it’s an important question because in though, as being effective bridge builders, there needs to be acknowledgment and heart level change, to really, personally that I think spills into our extended relationships and beyond. So some of it is pure ignorance and lack of exposure. So for me growing up in Colorado, without any black friends growing up, you know, I, I cherish my my friends of color. And and I have experienced more support and solidarity from my black brothers and sisters, sometimes more than even in my Asian community because sometimes people in my Asian community considered themselves white, like, were people of color, we don’t consider ourselves people of color like BIPOC, where do we fit into, you know. And so even within the black community, I have had conversations with some of my black sisters who are like, I didn’t expect to see Asians in this space for women of color, like, and so there’s just a lot of confusion sometimes, because of all the things that you just mentioned, Faitth, the model minority myth and the pitting against and I, I am so grateful for the leadership of the black community in civil rights that have made way for in justices to be exposed, that Asian Americans AAPI, people can have a different life because of we stand on the shoulders of the leadership of the black community. And I don’t think that we necessarily understand that in the Asian community. So there’s challenges because because of the Chinese Exclusion Act, because of some of the other historical things, the immigration of a lot of Asian communities has come later. So then you have a language barrier. And so in a Rodney King situation where you have Korean Americans who are Korean, born in Korea, and have immigrated the United States later who are trying to start their lives and create a better future for their children, but they don’t speak English. And they’re trying to run their convenience stores. And they’re told to fear black people, which, you know, and then there’s the cultural piece, which, you know, it’s like, it’s rude for Asians to look people in the eyes. And someone who’s black is like, that’s so disrespectful, you know, and it’s, it’s an honoring thing for Asians to not put money into the hands of somebody, you push the money. That’s a way of honoring, but that can seem very off putting to someone who doesn’t understand that cultural value. So there’s just so much that needs to be untangled. And for the children, the second generation kids who do understand English, there’s the untangling of the older generation, who are just locked into anti-blackness, just the rhetoric and the belief system that is so wrong. And so it really is that I probably talk about having to undo our own biases, and even within the Asian community, you know, people because of colonization of the Japanese in Korea, I mean, there’s just so much history that I’m still even learning today. But because of all of that there’s the other thing that we just naturally do as people. And so I think, for me, personally, it has been a journey to learn history, to become informed, and to have real relationships with real people. Because now that I do have some incredible relationships with my friends in the black community, whenever there is another Amhaud, or Brianna, or whatever it matters to me, and I see the hashtag as my friends, these are my family. And that doesn’t cut. I think that that’s what shifts for me Faitth, it’s like, because I really have genuine conversations and relationships that go back and forth and I’m challenged by it. Because it moves from my head to my heart. I think that that changes. And then because this is where I really believe leadership matters. Because when leaders are informed and transformed, it can change entire cultures of organizations, churches, communities. It can change everything, but it really requires that kind of a repentance, a humility, a learning posture, listening posture, and for me in my community, a challenge to speak up and to speak out and to let our voices be heard. And to say we’re still here. And so what’s so interesting is that because February is Black History Month, and there was also at the same time this uptick of anti-Asian hate crimes, stop AAPI hate. My team and I were like, how are we going to respond to this? I ended up doing a quick six-minute video. There was a tension like I don’t want to take away from Black History Month. Like, this is a time to honor my black brothers and sisters. And yet this was a time too that this is this is affecting my community. And so how do we navigate, still honoring Black History Month while also expressing. And so that’s again, where I think we have to move into abundance mentality that black history is not it does not have learning Black History does not have to be relegated to just one month in the same way that Asian American history is. I think that’s March or May or something like that, but you don’t like it. Let’s just have it year long, and have an abundance mentality.

Faitth Brooks  30:44  

Wow, this is so good. Let’s take a really quick break. And we will be back shortly be prepared to learn something new.

Tandria Potts  30:53  

If you are listening to today’s podcast and would like to become a bridge-builder in your community, guess what? Be The Bridge programs are available for youth, college students, adults BIPOC and transracial adoptees, and adoptive parents, our desire is for people to have healthy conversations about race. So we’ve provided guides to lead people through these discussions, visit our shop at BeTheBridge.com to grab a guide and start conversations in your community.

Faitth Brooks  31:23  

Thanks for staying with us.

Madison Potts  31:27  

Dr. King said we must learn to live together as brothers or perish together as fools. Othering is the practice of separating from those that we view as other or so unlike ourselves. It is at that point that our calling as an organization and Vivian’s calling as a bridge-builder comes into focus. Let’s pick it up here.

Faitth Brooks  31:49  

I think we all can relate to the feeling of just being othered you know, and fighting for your, you know, whether it’s your place and space, and, you know, trying to navigate, you know, all of these feelings. You know, I want to ask you why bridge-building is important to you?

Vivian Mabuni 32:15  

Mm hmm. Well, bridge building, I think is key, because we all are residents of the same planet. And we and we are all as believers going to worship God together in the same place, you know, so it’s like, it’s just, it behooves us to celebrate the beautiful tapestry, that is people made in the image of God. And I know that left to myself, I will read the scriptures a certain way. And I’m going to bring in my lens. So as a woman, I’m noticing every story of women in the Bible, right, I was listening in our experiences influence how we respond. So my friends who’ve dealt with infertility, they read some of the stories and scriptures very differently than someone who hasn’t. When we only have a white male perspective, on any particular passage of scripture, we’re missing out. And so I think in the same way, bridge building is so important, because it gives us a fuller picture of the world, of God, of the kingdom, of all of the places that we share. And I think bridge building also helps to be a place so that there can be greater understanding that we take back to our other communities. So when I have the opportunity to share with you Faitth that, you know, as an Asian, I’m not going to volunteer, to do things, I’ll always try to push someone else forward. That’s just the way that we work as a collective. Right? So for you to invite me into that space, I feel honored, I’ll do my best and bringing, I’ll bring all of who I am to it, but you may not otherwise know and think that I’m just kind of passive. And, you know, just I’m not really a leader or I don’t, you know, have an opinion, which is so far from the truth, as you know, now, but that’s why I think bridge-building is so important to have even those little experiences and to understand, and I think it goes in so many directions. That’s I think, you know, we love Tasha but I remember there’s a post that Tasha made where she went to a Garth Brooks concert, you know, just, you know, I think we all need to get into each other’s worlds a little bit to have a greater understanding of this is what this is about, you know, so I think it’s just so good and so right to have as many opportunities to invite each other into each other’s worlds, and to be able to celebrate those things.

Madison Potts  35:05  

That was awesome, right? I know you’re wondering how you can find out more about Vivian, what she’s passionate about, and her upcoming bridge-building endeavors. Listen carefully. 

Vivian Mabuni 35:15  

I am so excited. We are just getting started with Someday Is Here. And the team is jelling and everything is in wet cement. And it’s just this beautiful, creating, you know, while the airplane is flying, we’re still building it. So it’s just all kinds of wonderful and thrilling and terrifying at the same time. One of the things I would love, in addition to the podcast, which I think is a great place, we have a Did You Know section which is about history, so many things that we may not otherwise know, there’s a, there’s highlighting, but in the podcast itself, I’ve interviewed a whole range of women from varying backgrounds. And their stories are so insightful to understand the vastness of the AAPI community. And we’ve just touched the surface of that. But we’ve talked about leadership and how we live out our Eastern Western values. But what I really want your listeners to know about and to share with their friends and who this would serve, is that we’re going to have a virtual event in May, with an incredible lineup of AAPI women, but we have nine tracks, we have an adoption track, which we will have Asian AAPI women who are transracial adoptees sharing their stories, as well as parents who have adopted children of Asian descent and how to navigate that and how to celebrate that will have a track on mental illness, we will have a track on mixed-race identity and mixed-race relationships. I mean, these are spaces where there are not a lot of resources, currently, but it really does matter. When an Asian person marries a white person or another a person of any other ethnicity. There’s just clashes that come about relationally. And how do you raise your mixed-race kids to really honor all parts of their story? We will have one on allyship and justice and racial reconciliation. We’ll have one on growing as a believer. I mean, just I’m so excited about that. So save the date for May 15 for that event, and we’ll have more but people can find us. On Instagram @SomedayIsHerePodcast is the Instagram place. I’m @VivMabuni, on Twitter and Instagram and we have website, VivianMabuni.com and SomedayIsHere.co our websites where we have merchandise, so if you want to support us, we have no central funds at this point. So there’s places to donate if you just want to donate to a great cause, as well as purchasing, you know, representation matters sweatshirts and really fun hats and bags and things like that. But we would love for listeners to just link arms with us. And if you are a believer, we would love your prayers. And for you to just be sharing about our little adventure.

Madison Potts  38:27  

Vivian is awesome. I love her and Faitths conversation and look forward to be the bridge expanding conversations on racial reconciliation with all people groups. We will continue our series entitled She’s The Bridge in our next podcast. Well, it has been fun stepping in as your guest host. We have to say bye for now. But until next time, let’s remember to build bridges and not walls.

Faitth Brooks  38:54  

If you are a member of the donor’s table, you get access to today’s unedited episode. Go check it out.

Narrator  39:02  

Thanks for listening to the Be The Bridge podcast. To find out more about the Be The Bridge organization and or to become a bridge-builder in your community, go to BeTheBridge.com again, that’s BeTheBridge.com. If you’ve enjoyed this podcast, remember to rate and review it on this platform and share it with as many people as you possibly can. You can also connect with us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. Today’s show was edited, recorded and produced by Travon Potts at Integrated Entertainment Studios in metro Atlanta, Georgia. The host and executive producer is Latasha Morrison. Lauren C. Brown is the senior producer. Travon Potts was our transcriber. Please join us next time this has been at Be The Bridge productions.